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Question:

> I remember that Pan Am used to fly to both Tahiti and Bali from > Hong Kong. I assume that these routes were part of the United > purchase of the Pacific Routes.  It just seems weird that you > hear often of airlines moaning that they do not get the route > authorities they want (AA to NRT, DL to China) but they have > all these unused ones. > It would seem that United could fill a daily 767 (at least) from > either of their hubs at HKG or NRT.  Do these unused authorities > expire if the airline doesn’t use them?

I can’t say for sure what conditions were attached to routes granted in the days of Pan Am  or those specific markets, but the Department of Transportation today routinely attaches a 90-day dormancy condition to routes: use it or lose it (or ask for a waiver).

Response:

Supposedly, AC has tons that they’re just sitting on, especially from Montreal, where their European service is a joke.. Paris, London, and other random city (currently FRA.. helped out by being in Star).  Does CO still serve Denpasar? Matthew (shouldn’t be badmouthing AC.. not when I’m getting on one of their DC-9s in 16 hours) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > It just seems weird that you hear often of airlines moaning that > they do not get the route authorities they want (AA to NRT, DL to China) > but > they have all these unused ones.

Response:

I remember that Pan Am used to fly to both Tahiti and Bali from Hong Kong. I assume that these routes were part of the United purchase of the Pacific Routes.  It just seems weird that you hear often of airlines moaning that they do not get the route authorities they want (AA to NRT, DL to China) but they have all these unused ones. It would seem that United could fill a daily 767 (at least) from either of their hubs at HKG or NRT.  Do these unused authorities expire if the airline doesn’t use them?  Is there a comprehensive listing of them anywhere?

Response:

The short answer here is that United probably does not serve these routes because they can make higher profits serving other routes with more business travelers. Most airlines make their real money from people traveling on business, who generally pay much, much higher fares than the leisure traveler.

Response:

> I remember that Pan Am used to fly to both Tahiti and Bali from Hong Kong. > I assume that these routes were part of the United purchase of the Pacific > Routes.  It just seems weird that you hear often of airlines moaning that > they do not get the route authorities they want (AA to NRT, DL to China) but > they have all these unused ones. > It would seem that United could fill a daily 767 (at least) from either of > their hubs at HKG or NRT.  Do these unused authorities expire if the airline > doesn’t use them?  Is there a comprehensive listing of them anywhere?

Well, first of all, United does not have a "hub" in HKG.  They only fly to NRT, SFO, LAX, and SIN from there (as far as I know, I’m doing this from memory).  Secondly, I can’t remember seeing anything other than United 747’s and 777’s anywhere in Asia.  And since most of United’s passengers travel to HKG from the east, Tahiti would not be a logical destination (unless, of course, you’re an RTA’er that wants to rack up some extra mileage).

Response: